Jab's Builds: Fear Lords, Dark Man, DC's Thriller, The S-Men

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Jabroniville
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Re: Jab's Builds: Terror Inc., Micromax, Lilith, Bloodaxe, C

Postby Jabroniville » Sat Oct 13, 2012 11:03 pm

Image

GHOST RIDER II (Johnny Blaze)- 1970s Version
Created By:
Roy Thomas, Gary Friedrich & Mike Ploog
First Appearance: Marvel Spotlight #5 (Aug. 1972)
Role: '70s Super-Hero
Group Affiliation: The Champions, The Midnight Sons, The Defenders, The Legion of Monsters, The Heroes For Hire
PL 9 (180)
STRENGTH
8 STAMINA -- AGILITY 5
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 5
INTELLIGENCE 3 AWARENESS 3 PRESENCE 3

Skills:
Deception 2 (+5)
Expertise (Demonic Lore) 2 (+5)
Expertise (Stuntman) 8 (+10)
Insight 2 (+5)
Intimidation 5 (+8)
Perception 1 (+4)
Ranged Combat (Hellfire) 2 (+10)
Vehicles 10 (+15) -- Flaws: Limited to Ground Vehicles

Advantages:
Daze (Intimidation), Diehard, Equipment 2 (Motorbike), Move-By Action, Ranged Attack 3, Skill Mastery (Vehicles), Ultimate Vehicles Skill, Startle

Powers:
Soulfire Blast 8 (Extras: Will Save) (24) -- [25]
    AE: Hellfire Blast 8 (Feats: Penetrating 4) (20)
Regeneration 4 (Feats: Regrow Limbs) [5]
Immunity 30 (Fortitude Effects) [30]
Protection 8 [8]

"Frickin' Sweet Ride"
Speed 8 (500 mph) (Flaws: Requires Bike) [4]
Movement 2 (Wall-Crawling, Water-Walking) (Flaws: Requires Bike) [2]
"Ride Through Flames" Damage 8 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Shapeable +2) (Flaws: Limited to Movement Path, Requires Bike) [8]

Offense:
Unarmed +10 (+8 Damage, DC 23)
Hellfire +10 (+8 Ranged Damage, DC 23)
Soulfire +10 (+8 Ranged Will Damage, DC 23)
Initiative +5

Defenses:
Dodge +10 (DC 20), Parry +10 (DC 20), Toughness +8, Fortitude --, Will +7

Complications:
Involuntary Transformation (Ghost Rider)- Johnny Blaze will transform into Ghost Rider any time he needs to punish the evil. Blaze's own stats are STR 2 & STA 4- the rest are the same.
Enemy (Zarathos)- Blaze hates the Demon Zarathos for possessing him for years.

Total: Abilities: 64 / Skills: 28--14 / Advantages: 11 / Powers: 82 / Defenses: 9 (180)

-The first Ghost Rider is another supernatural 1970s hero, who lasted quite a while (81 issues). His creation is a bit tricky, as Roy Thomas & Gary Friedrich have both suggested they came up with the flaming skull motif (mainly because Friedrich keeps trying to sue over the movie rights- Marvel soon bankrupted him and disallowed him from even ADVERTISING his part in the creation of Johnny Blaze- that's what they call having a crappy lawyer). Johnny Blaze sold his soul to Mephisto in order to let his stepfather Crash Simpson have his cancer be cured, only for Crash to die in a stunt days later. Mephisto could not take Johnny's soul properly, since the purity of his stepsister's love for him drove The Devil-Guy away, so he bonded him to the Demon Zarathos instead.

-His book was a pretty minor deal, though attained some popularity- he ended up on the weird slapdash team known as The Champions. However, he was gone for almost the entirety of the 1980s, and only revealed himself anew when GR was revived in the form of Danny Ketch in the 1990s. Blaze soon showed up as a sunglasses-wearing, stubble-having grim bad-ass with a longcoat and a motorbike (doing his best imitation of EVERY OTHER FREAKING CHARACTER IN 1990S COMICS!!!). After this '90s run was over and Ghost Rider became a dead concept again, Blaze came back to the forefront thanks to the "Ghost Rider" films, and the next few comic series turned HIM into Ghost Rider again, leaving Danny Ketch by the wayside.

-I have the first handful of issues of one series, and it's not really GOOD, but has a funny concept- Blaze versus Satan, and Satan resurrected himself into 666 bodies that Ghost Rider must kill. His series is still ongoing, though I haven't cared to read it- I dislike mystical/hell stuff in general, and I never found the character very interesting. His Wikipedia article is HUGE, too- one of those ones where some fan has basically just reviewed and included every single issue in the synopsis.

-The '70s Ghost Rider is okay, but not really super-powerful- the 1970s was truly the era of STREET-LEVEL fighters, with Ghost Rider, Iron Fist, Luke Cage and others all effectively being PL 9 guys. Heck, Spider-Man & Daredevil had prime eras here as well, and were about the same (though Spidey probably made PL 10). Despite his lower PL, he's quite pricey given all the Undead/Blaster stuff on him.

-The Bike mechanics are a bit funny, but basically a Ghost Rider can touch any motorbike and turn it into the "Hellcycle" or whatever you wanna call it. He gains these powers (basically enhanced Speed, Movement and an Area Damage effect), but only if he has a bike with him to turn.

---

Image
Image

JOHNNY BLAZE
Created By:
Roy Thomas, Gary Friedrich & Mike Ploog
First Appearance: Marvel Spotlight #5 (Aug. 1972)
Role: '70s Super-Hero, Blaster, Gun Guy
Group Affiliation: The Champions, The Midnight Sons, The Defenders, The Legion of Monsters, The Heroes For Hire
PL 10 (136)
STRENGTH
2 STAMINA 4 AGILITY 5
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 5
INTELLIGENCE 3 AWARENESS 3 PRESENCE 3

Skills:
Deception 4 (+6)
Expertise (Demonic Lore) 4 (+6)
Expertise (Streetwise) 2 (+4)
Expertise (Stuntman) 8 (+10)
Insight 2 (+5)
Intimidation 4 (+6)
Investigation 2 (+5)
Perception 3 (+6)
Persuasion 2 (+4)
Ranged Combat (Guns) 2 (+12)
Vehicles 10 (+15) -- Flaws: Limited to Ground Vehicles

Advantages:
All-Out Attack, Daze (Intimidation), Diehard, Equipment 3 (Motorbike), Improved Critical (Hellfire Gun), Improved Smash, Move-By Action, Power Attack, Quick Draw, Ranged Attack 5, Skill Mastery (Vehicles), Ultimate Vehicles Skill, Startle

Powers:
"Hellfire-Spitting Pump-Gun" (Flaws: Easily Removable) [15]
Soulfire Blast 8 (Extras: Will Save) (24) -- (25 points)
    AE: Hellfire Blast 8 (Feats: Penetrating 4) (20)
Offense:
Unarmed +12 (+3 Damage, DC 18)
Hellfire Gun +12 (+8 Ranged Damage, DC 23)
Soulfire +12 (+8 Ranged Will Damage, DC 23)
Initiative +5

Defenses:
Dodge +11 (DC 21), Parry +11 (DC 21), Toughness +4, Fortitude +5, Will +8

Complications:
Enemy (Zarathos)- Blaze hates the Demon Zarathos for possessing him for years.
Relationship (Danny Ketch)- Blaze and Ketch became great allies during their ride as "Spirts of Vengeance", and later discovered they were long-lost brothers.

Total: Abilities: 70 / Skills: 38--19 / Advantages: 19 / Powers: 15 / Defenses: 13 (136)

-The gritty human Johnny Blaze was basically a human-level Gunfighter (but with a REALLY powerful gun) who was a strong ally for Ghost Rider, though a bit under-PL on defense. Despite that, he's much more skilled and full of Advantages compared to his '70s self- the years made him a better, more knowledeable fighter.

---

Image

GHOST RIDER II (Johnny Blaze)- Modern Version
Created By:
Roy Thomas, Gary Friedrich & Mike Ploog
First Appearance: Marvel Spotlight #5 (Aug. 1972)
Role: Mystical Super-Hero
Group Affiliation: The Champions, The Midnight Sons, The Defenders, The Legion of Monsters, The Heroes For Hire
PL 13 (243)
STRENGTH
8 STAMINA -- AGILITY 5
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 5
INTELLIGENCE 3 AWARENESS 3 PRESENCE 3

Skills:
Deception 4 (+6)
Expertise (Demonic Lore) 4 (+6)
Expertise (Streetwise) 2 (+4)
Expertise (Stuntman) 8 (+10)
Insight 2 (+5)
Intimidation 4 (+6)
Investigation 2 (+5)
Perception 3 (+6)
Persuasion 2 (+4)
Vehicles 10 (+15) -- Flaws: Limited to Ground Vehicles

Advantages:
All-Out Attack, Daze (Intimidation), Diehard, Equipment 3 (Motorbike), Improved Critical (Hellfire), Improved Smash, Move-By Action, Power Attack, Quick Draw, Ranged Attack 5, Skill Mastery (Vehicles), Ultimate Vehicles Skill, Startle

Powers:
"The Penance Stare" Affliction 13 (Will; Dazed & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless/Incapacitated) (Feats: Incurable) (Extras: Perception Range +2, Extra Condition) (Flaws: Visual Sense-Dependent) (Quirks: Limited to Amount of Pain Target Has Caused -1) Linked to Blast 8 (Feats: Incurable) (Extras: Perception Range, Will Save) (Flaws: Visual Sense-Dependent) (Quirks: Same as Affliction) (63) -- [68]
    AE: Soulfire Blast 13 (Extras: Will Save) (39)
    AE: Hellfire Blast 13 (Feats: Penetrating 8) (34)
    AE: "Chain" Blast 8 (Feats: Extended Reach, Accurate 2) (19)
    AE: "Moving Chain" Damage 8 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Shapeable +2) (24)
    AE: "Chain Snare" Snare 11 (Flaws: Limited to A Few Targets) (22)
Regeneration 4 (Feats: Regrow Limbs) [5]
Immunity 30 (Fortitude Effects) [30]
Protection 9 [9]

"Frickin' Sweet Ride"
Speed 8 (500 mph) (Flaws: Requires Bike) [4]
Movement 2 (Wall-Crawling, Water-Walking) (Flaws: Requires Bike) [2]
"Ride Through Flames" Damage 9 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Shapeable +2) (Flaws: Limited to Movement Path, Requires Bike) [9]

Offense:
Unarmed +10 (+8 Damage, DC 23)
Hellfire +10 (+13 Ranged Damage, DC 28)
Soulfire +10 (+13 Ranged Will Damage, DC 28)
Penance Stare -- (+13 Perception-Ranged Affliction & +8 Damage, DC 23 & 23)
Chain +14 (+8 Ranged Damage, DC 23)
Moving Chain +8 Area (+8 Damage, DC 23)
Chain Snare +10 (+11 Ranged Affliction, DC 21)
Ride Through Flames +9 Area (+9 Damage, DC 24)
Initiative +5

Defenses:
Dodge +10 (DC 20), Parry +10 (DC 20), Toughness +9, Fortitude --, Will +7

Complications:
Involuntary Transformation (Ghost Rider)- Johnny Blaze will transform into Ghost Rider any time he needs to punish the evil. Blaze's own stats are STR 2 & STA 4- the rest are the same.
Enemy (Zarathos)- Blaze hates the Demon Zarathos for possessing him for years.
Relationship (Danny Ketch)- Blaze and Ketch became great allies during their ride as "Spirts of Vengeance", and later discovered they were long-lost brothers.

Total: Abilities: 70 / Skills: 36--18 / Advantages: 19 / Powers: 127 / Defenses: 9 (243)

-The Ghost Rider series in modern times gave Johnny a LUDICROUS power-upgrade, turning a guy who could barely hold his own with Spider-Man into a guy strong enough to rip a skyscraper in half with his chain (just by driving around it on his bike) and fight Warbound/Green Scar Hulk for a while, with Doctor Strange implying that his power is limitless. This version of Blaze essentially rockets his Power Level up a few notches, and gives him all of Danny Ketch's old powers (because they wanted the original character, but all the cool powers of his later self). In any case, I think this covers most of it, but it might not- Blaze changes power-sets enough that Besty Freaking Braddock would go "woah, bloke- let's try some consistency, shall we?"
Last edited by Jabroniville on Sun Sep 15, 2013 8:09 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Jab's Builds: Terror Inc., Micromax, Lilith, Bloodaxe, Cyber

Postby badpenny » Sun Oct 14, 2012 7:08 am

Jabroniville wrote:-The first Ghost Rider is another supernatural 1970s hero, who lasted quite a while (81 issues). His creation is a bit tricky, as Roy Thomas & Gary Friedrich have both suggested they came up with the flaming skull motif (mainly because Friedrich keeps trying to sue over the movie rights- Marvel soon bankrupted him and disallowed him from even ADVERTISING his part in the creation of Johnny Blaze- that's what they call having a crappy lawyer).


Crappy lawyer is right. Friedrich gets a "Conceived and Written by" and Roy Thomas gets an "Aid and Abetment" credit. :roll:

The real question, though, is why is he wearing Black Widow's belt?

Image
Screen cap from Marvel Spotlight #5 (splash page)

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Re: Jab's Builds: Lilith, Bloodaxe, Cyber, Ghost Rider (Blaz

Postby Jabroniville » Sun Oct 14, 2012 7:17 pm

Image

GHOST RIDER III (Daniel "Danny" Ketch)
Created By:
Howard Mackie & Javier Saltares
First Appearance: Ghost Rider #1 (May 1990)
Role: Mystical Super-Hero
Group Affiliation: The Midnight Sons, The Secret Defenders, The New Fantastic Four
PL 12 (217)
STRENGTH
8 STAMINA -- AGILITY 5
FIGHTING 11 DEXTERITY 5
INTELLIGENCE 1 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 1

Skills:
Deception 3 (+4)
Expertise (Demonic Lore) 4 (+5)
Expertise (Streetwise) 1 (+2)
Insight 2 (+4)
Intimidation 11 (+12)
Investigation 2 (+4)
Perception 3 (+5)
Vehicles 8 (+13) -- Flaws: Limited to Ground Vehicles

Advantages:
All-Out Attack, Daze (Intimidation), Diehard, Equipment 2 (Motorbike), Improved Critical (Chain), Improved Disarm, Improved Smash, Move-By Action, Power Attack, Ranged Attack 5, Startle, Takedown

Powers:
"The Penance Stare" Affliction 12 (Will; Dazed & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless/Incapacitated) (Feats: Incurable) (Extras: Perception Range +2, Extra Condition) (Flaws: Visual Sense-Dependent) (Quirks: Limited to Amount of Pain Target Has Caused -1) Linked to Blast 6 (Feats: Incurable) (Extras: Perception Range, Will Save) (Flaws: Visual Sense-Dependent) (Quirks: Same as Affliction) (54) -- [60]
    AE: Soulfire Blast 8 (Extras: Will Save) (24)
    AE: Hellfire Blast 8 (Feats: Penetrating 8) (24)
    AE: "Chain" Blast 7 (Feats: Extended Reach, Accurate) (16)
    AE: "Moving Chain" Damage 7 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Shapeable +2) (21)
    AE: "Chain Snare" Snare 8 (Flaws: Limited to A Few Targets) (16)
    AE: "Shuriken Chain" Blast 5 (Feats: Accurate 2, Extended Reach) (Extras: Multiattack) (20)
Regeneration 4 (Feats: Regrow Limbs) [5]
Immunity 30 (Fortitude Effects) [30]
Protection 8 [8]

"Frickin' Sweet Ride"
Speed 8 (500 mph) (Flaws: Requires Bike) [4]
Movement 2 (Wall-Crawling, Water-Walking) (Flaws: Requires Bike) [2]
"Ride Through Flames" Damage 9 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Shapeable +2) (Flaws: Limited to Movement Path, Requires Bike) [9]

Offense:
Unarmed +11 (+8 Damage, DC 23)
Hellfire +10 (+8 Ranged Damage, DC 23)
Soulfire +10 (+8 Ranged Will Damage, DC 23)
Penance Stare -- (+12 Perception-Ranged Affliction & +6 Damage, DC 22 & 21)
Chain +12 (+7 Ranged Damage, DC 22)
Moving Chain +7 Area (+7 Damage, DC 22)
Chain Snare +10 (+8 Ranged Affliction, DC 18)
Ride Through Flames +9 Area (+9 Damage, DC 24)
Initiative +5

Defenses:
Dodge +10 (DC 20), Parry +11 (DC 21), Toughness +8, Fortitude --, Will +7

Complications:
Involuntary Transformation (Ghost Rider)- Danny Ketch will transform into Ghost Rider any time he needs to punish the evil. Ketch's own stats are STR 1 & STA 3- the rest are the same.
Enemy (Deathwatch, Blackout)- Ghost Rider had a few recurring rogues- Blackout murdered his comatose sister.
Relationship (Johnny Blaze)- Blaze and Ketch became great allies during their ride as "Spirts of Vengeance", and later discovered they were long-lost brothers.
Power Loss (Penance Stare)- The Penance Stare, in addition to losing effect over innocent beings guilty of no wrongdoing, will not affect those under the influence of drugs, or those with more than two eyes (??). Nor will it work on soulless beings.

Total: Abilities: 56 / Skills: 30--15 / Advantages: 17 / Powers: 118 / Defenses: 11 (217)

-With the age of black leather, pockets, darkness and blood upon us, it was perhaps only a matter of time before Ghost Rider made a comeback- with a flaming demonic head, gory transformation sequences (his face MELTS, as Mark Texiera was only too happy to draw for us), and leather 'n' spikes everywhere, he was a natural. Curiously, despite bringing back dozens of old characters for a new '90s-style Marvel Universe (The New Warriors were comprised of them, we also had Luke Cage), this Ghost Rider was a new legacy character who got beaten up by Deathwatch and his gang, in an attack that put his sister into a coma. The book was a BIG hit (enough to gain him membership to a temporary Fantastic Four and a big super team-up with the other Grim 'n' Gritty characters, Wolverine & The Punisher), and Danny Ketch was soon palling around with the original Ghost Rider and having a TON of books spin off of the central theme.

-Ghost Rider in the '90s is essentially a PL 10-ish fighter with a PL 12 Penance Stare attack (anyone know the total range of that attack? One site says he needed to be in grabbing range for it to work, but I could swear I've seen him do it just by looking at a dude once), losing a lot of power and versatility to Johnny Blaze (though more powerful than the '70s Ghost Rider by a ways). He's strong and mean, but not staggeringly more powerful than a number of his foes.
Last edited by Jabroniville on Sun Sep 15, 2013 8:13 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Jab's Builds: Lilith, Bloodaxe, Cyber, Ghost Rider (Blaz

Postby Jabroniville » Sun Oct 14, 2012 7:19 pm

Image

VENGEANCE (Lieutenant Michael Badilino)
Created By:
Howard Mackie, Ron Wagner & Mark Texiera
First Appearance: Ghost Rider #21 (Jan. 1992)
Role: Totally '90s Creation
Group Affiliation: The New York Police Department, The Midnight Sons
PL 12 (213)
STRENGTH
9 STAMINA -- AGILITY 5
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 5
INTELLIGENCE 1 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 1

Skills:
Deception 2 (+3)
Expertise (Police Officer) 4 (+5)
Insight 1 (+2)
Intimidation 12 (+13)
Perception 3 (+5)
Vehicles 4 (+9) -- Flaws: Limited to Ground Vehicles

Advantages:
All-Out Attack, Daze (Intimidation), Diehard, Equipment 3 (Motorbike), Improved Critical (Chain), Improved Disarm, Improved Smash, Move-By Action, Power Attack, Ranged Attack 5, Startle, Takedown

Powers:
"The Penance Stare" Affliction 12 (Will; Dazed & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless/Incapacitated) (Feats: Incurable) (Extras: Perception Range +2, Extra Condition) (Flaws: Visual Sense-Dependent) (Quirks: Limited to Amount of Pain Target Has Caused -1) Linked to Blast 6 (Feats: Incurable) (Extras: Perception Range, Will Save) (Flaws: Visual Sense-Dependent) (Quirks: Same as Affliction) (54) -- [61]
    AE: Soulfire Blast 8 (Extras: Will Save) (24)
    AE: Hellfire Blast 8 (Feats: Penetrating 8) (24)
    AE: "Chain" Blast 7 (Feats: Extended Reach, Accurate) (16)
    AE: "Moving Chain" Damage 7 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Shapeable +2) (21)
    AE: "Chain Snare" Snare 8 (Flaws: Limited to A Few Targets) (16)
    AE: "Shuriken Chain" Blast 5 (Feats: Accurate 2, Extended Reach) (Extras: Multiattack) (20)
    AE: "Detachable Body Spikes" Strength-Damage +1 (1)
Regeneration 4 (Feats: Regrow Limbs) [5]
Immunity 30 (Fortitude Effects) [30]
Protection 9 [9]

"Frickin' Sweet Ride"
Speed 8 (500 mph) (Flaws: Requires Bike) [4]
Movement 2 (Wall-Crawling, Water-Walking) (Flaws: Requires Bike) [2]
"Ride Through Flames" Damage 9 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Shapeable +2) (Flaws: Limited to Movement Path, Requires Bike) [9]

Offense:
Unarmed +10 (+9 Damage, DC 24)
Body Spikes +10 (+10 Damage, DC 25)
Hellfire +10 (+8 Ranged Damage, DC 23)
Soulfire +10 (+8 Ranged Will Damage, DC 23)
Penance Stare -- (+12 Perception-Ranged Affliction & +6 Damage, DC 22 & 21)
Chain +12 (+7 Ranged Damage, DC 22)
Moving Chain +7 Area (+7 Damage, DC 22)
Chain Snare +10 (+8 Ranged Affliction, DC 18)
Initiative +5

Defenses:
Dodge +9 (DC 19), Parry +10 (DC 20), Toughness +9, Fortitude --, Will +5

Complications:
Involuntary Transformation (Ghost Rider)- The Lieutenant will transform into Vengeance any time he needs to punish the evil. Badilino's own stats are STR 1 & STA 3- the rest are the same. He also goes crazy sometimes, and can't control his own actions.
Power Loss (Penance Stare)- The Penance Stare, in addition to losing effect over innocent beings guilty of no wrongdoing, will not affect those under the influence of drugs, or those with more than two eyes (??). Nor will it work on soulless beings.

Total: Abilities: 56 / Skills: 24--12 / Advantages: 18 / Powers: 120 / Defenses: 7 (213)

-Vengeance is basically what happens when the writer runs out of ideas, and then goes "hey, y'know what our hero needs? A VENOM!" Basically, Howard Mackie created a guy who was essentially Ghost Rider, but MORE BAD-ASS, adding huge size, chains and junk, while also being an antagonist. Actually, I saw a picture of him and thought he was pretty sweet when I was a kid (I even made a supervillain with the same name, then called him "Revengeance" before deciding that was just too much), so I wasn't ALWAYS the type to turn up his nose at all the over-the-top '90s stuff.

-So Lt. Badilino here thought his family was killed by the demon Zarathos, and went out hunting Ghost Rider. Eventually discovering that Danny Ketch WASN'T Zarathos, he started teaming up with him and the rest of the Midnight Sons line. He stuck around for a fair bit, but eventually took his own life after being driven insane (he wanted to protect innocents from himself). He ends up helping Noble Kale (the demon formerly possessing Danny Ketch) rule Hell, because later Ghost Rider stuff is weird. A later guy (a dude named Deputy Kowalski who had his hand eaten by a cannibal) gained Vengeance powers came later, but he was swiftly made a joke character alongside The Orb.

-Bios indicate that Vengeance had the EXACT SAME POWERS Ghost Rider did, which makes him a trifle dull. The only thing different is his detachable body spikes.
Last edited by Jabroniville on Sun Sep 08, 2013 9:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Jab's Builds: Cyber, Ghost Riders- Blaze, Ketch & Vengeance!

Postby Batgirl III » Sun Oct 14, 2012 7:59 pm

"1993 was the year Superman died and Venom got his own series."

That right there tells you just about everything you need to know about the Iron Age of comic books...
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Re: Jab's Builds: Lilith, Bloodaxe, Cyber, Ghost Rider (Blaze)

Postby saint_matthew » Sun Oct 14, 2012 8:49 pm

Jabroniville wrote:Basically, Howard Mackie created a guy who was essentially Ghost Rider, but MORE BAD-ASS, adding huge size, chains and junk, while also being an antagonist.


Which is kind of like making a new version of Lobo, who is a bigger bastich & more invunerable & has a more awesomer spazfrag. At some point you end up with a serious case of diminishing returns. :lol:
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Re: Jab's Builds: Lilith, Bloodaxe, Cyber, Ghost Rider (Blaze)

Postby Woodclaw » Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:13 am

saint_matthew wrote:
Jabroniville wrote:Basically, Howard Mackie created a guy who was essentially Ghost Rider, but MORE BAD-ASS, adding huge size, chains and junk, while also being an antagonist.


Which is kind of like making a new version of Lobo, who is a bigger bastich & more invunerable & has a more awesomer spazfrag. At some point you end up with a serious case of diminishing returns. :lol:


Which was basicly the premise of Lobo's personal serie, if you compare that to his original appearence.
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Re: Jab's Builds: Lilith, Bloodaxe, Cyber, Ghost Rider (Blaze)

Postby saint_matthew » Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:56 am

Woodclaw wrote:
saint_matthew wrote:
Jabroniville wrote:Basically, Howard Mackie created a guy who was essentially Ghost Rider, but MORE BAD-ASS, adding huge size, chains and junk, while also being an antagonist.


Which is kind of like making a new version of Lobo, who is a bigger bastich & more invunerable & has a more awesomer spazfrag. At some point you end up with a serious case of diminishing returns. :lol:


Which was basicly the premise of Lobo's personal serie, if you compare that to his original appearence.


Wasn't Lobo originally intended to be a satire of Ghostrider-esque characters?
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Re: Jab's Builds: Lilith, Bloodaxe, Cyber, Ghost Rider (Blaze)

Postby Woodclaw » Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:41 am

saint_matthew wrote:
Woodclaw wrote:
saint_matthew wrote:Which is kind of like making a new version of Lobo, who is a bigger bastich & more invunerable & has a more awesomer spazfrag. At some point you end up with a serious case of diminishing returns. :lol:


Which was basicly the premise of Lobo's personal serie, if you compare that to his original appearence.


Wasn't Lobo originally intended to be a satire of Ghostrider-esque characters?


Probably, but with his personal series, they turned him into an all-out pastiche of the worst 90-esque cliches about comics. The part that always gave me a gag reflex is how many people took that seriously.
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Re: Jab's Builds: Cyber, Ghost Riders- Blaze, Ketch & Vengeance!

Postby Batgirl III » Mon Oct 15, 2012 7:19 am

A key difference between Lobo, especially the first few years, and other "Dark Age" can be made... in a nut shell, Lobo was a good comic, most of the others weren't. Now, I've never made it a secret that I generally dislike the "Dark Age" as a whole and the particular sub-genre of the "Nineties Anti-Hero" is something I especially loathe... but even as a non-fan I can recognize that Lobo, Erik Larsen's The Savage Dragon, Alan Moore's Supreme, Garth Ennis' Hitman, and -- of course -- The Dark Knight Returns are all great comic books.

Most of what I hate about this period of comics is, well, the rest of it. You know... the things that looked like this. That most of this was also the short of "shovel ware" that eventually caused the Great Comics Crash is probably not unrelated.
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Re: Jab's Builds: Cyber, Ghost Riders- Blaze, Ketch & Vengeance!

Postby Devastation Bob » Mon Oct 15, 2012 7:35 am

I remember an issue where Ketch tried to lock the bike up because at the time touching the gas cap was what was triggering the transformation and the Bike got out of a storage cage by itself and got to him when he needed it.

Incidentally, the idea of "any bike will do" was giving me an idea, but it looks like someone beat me to the punch...

http://m7781.deviantart.com/art/GHOST-R ... -163865181
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Re: Jab's Builds: Cyber, Ghost Riders- Blaze, Ketch & Vengea

Postby Jabroniville » Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:01 pm

Image

BLOODSEED (Lysander Bloodseed)
Created By:
Paul Neary & Liam Sharp
First Appearance: Bloodseed #1 (Oct. 1993)
Role: Kinda-Conan Guy
PL 9 (106)
STRENGTH
4 STAMINA 5 AGILITY 4
FIGHTING 12 DEXTERITY 0
INTELLIGENCE 0 AWARENESS 0 PRESENCE 0

Skills:
Athletics 2 (+11)
Deception 2 (+4)
Expertise (Soldier) 4 (+5)
Expertise (Police Officer) 2 (+3)
Expertise (Science) 2 (+3)
Technology 4 (+5)

Advantages:
All-Out Attack, Diehard, Equipment (Helmet of Truth, Wrench), Fast Grab, Improved Critical (Wrench), Improved Hold, Power Attack, Ranged Attack 5, Takedown

Powers:
"Telekinesis" Move Object 10 (20) -- [21]
    AE: Healing 10 (20)
Equipment:
"Giant Wrench" Strength-Damage +2 (Feats: Reach) (3)
"Helmet of Truth" Senses 2 (Vision Counters Illusion) (2)

Offense:
Unarmed +12 (+4 Damage, DC 19)
Giant Wrench +12 (+6 Damage, DC 21)
Initiative +4

Defenses:
Dodge +11 (DC 21), Parry +12 (DC 22), Toughness +5, Fortitude +7, Will +5

Complications:
Enemy (Other Bloodseeds)- Bloodseed must fight all of his "brothers", until only one remains.

Total: Abilities: 50 / Skills: 16--8 / Advantages: 13 / Powers: 21 / Defenses: 14 (106)

-Bloodseed is some genetic creation of an ape-like race, doomed to wander around in a memory-less haze and fighting monsters, while all his fellow creations also had to kill him and each other to guarantee who will be the TRUE Bloodseed. It comes across as a very Conan-like "Wandering the world" story, with a solo shirtless barbarian hero fighting 'round the globe. According to the Marvel Appendix to the Official Handbook, Bloodseed was supposed to be in a four-part series, but it was cut into two 2-parters, the latter of which was cancelled (probably because the series was weird and silly and oh-so-mysterious), so we never saw the guy again. A little tough to do a build of such a vague guy (his Helmet of Truth could apparently be kinda-sentient, but really only helped him avoid illusions), but here's Bloodseed- a barbarian warrior with Healing & Telekinetic Powers.
Last edited by Jabroniville on Sun Sep 08, 2013 9:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Jab's Builds: Cyber, Ghost Riders- Blaze, Ketch & Vengea

Postby Jabroniville » Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:09 pm

Image

BLOODSCREAM
Created By:
Chris Claremont & John Buscema
First Appearance: Wolverine #4 (Feb. 1989)
Role: Classic '90s Vampire Villain
PL 10 (192)
STRENGTH
9 STAMINA 10 AGILITY 5
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 2 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 2

Skills:
Athletics 3 (+12)
Deception 2 (+4)
Expertise (Soldier) 4 (+6)
Expertise (Naval Officer/Pirate) 4 (+6)
Expertise (History) 8 (+10)
Intimidation 8 (+10)
Perception 4 (+6)
Stealth 1 (+6)

Advantages:
All-Out Attack, Chokehold, Close Attack, Daze (Intimidation), Diehard, Evasion, Fast Grab, Improved Critical (Unarmed), Improved Grab, Improved Initiative 2, Improved Hold, Power Attack, Startle, Tracking

Powers:
Immunity 10 (Life Support) [10]
Regeneration 10 (Feats: Regrow Limbs) [11]
Immortality 17 (30 seconds) (Flaws: Limited to Weapons Forged By Man) [17]
Speed 5 (60 mph) [5]
Senses (Low-Light Vision, Acute Scent) [2]

"Lifeforce Drain" Weaken Stamina 11 (Flaws: Grab-Based) (Inaccurate -1) Linked to Affliction 11 (Will; Entranced/Compelled/Controlled) (Extras: Cumulative) (Flaws: Grab-Based) (Inaccurate -1) [15]
Features 1: Places Red Hand-Print on Surivors if Lifeforce Drain [1]

Offense:
Unarmed +11 (+9 Damage, DC 24)
Lifeforce Drain +9 (+11 Affliction & Weaken, DC 21)
Initiative +13

Defenses:
Dodge +10 (DC 20), Parry +10 (DC 20), Toughness +10, Fortitude +12, Will +6

Complications:
Motivation (The Blood of a Man Who Doesn't Age)- The only thing that can cure Bloodscream's condition is a potion made from the blood of a man who doesn't age. Coincidentally, Bloodscream eventually encountered Wolverine in separate incidences decades apart, and noticed Logan didn't age in that span.

Total: Abilities: 88 / Skills: 34--17 / Advantages: 15 / Powers: 61 / Defenses: 11 (192)

-Bloodscream is a very Gritty villain-type, but predates many of the more ludicrous characters from the '90s by a ways. A Claremont creation, he was a vampire-like being hunting Logan because of the properties of his un-aging blood, and often teamed up with Roughouse as a sort of Recurring-Nemesis for Logan's own solo series (up till that point, he'd mostly fought Sabretooth as a rival, so he needed a bigger rogues gallery). I remember him mainly for his monstrous form, which was basically the same but scarier-looking, and he got more frenzied (I'd say that's more using All-Out or Power Attack more often, really). He's a quite fearsome PL 10 guy, with a REALLY dangerous Lifeforce Drain power that can even control minds.

-That whole "Can't be slain by weapons forged by man" thing is either an Immunity or an Immortality effect (basically regenerating from fatal damage)- I think both can be HURT by stuff like Wolverine's claws, but they can't be permanently brought down by them. An Immunity would cost only slightly more (either a flat 20 points- "Immune to Man-Forged Weapons" or a full Immunity to Damage 80 with a -2 Flaw for the same so it wouldn't cover fire, most super-powers, inborne claws, etc.), so I think the 17 points here is fair.
Last edited by Jabroniville on Sun Sep 08, 2013 9:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Jab's Builds: Ghost Riders, Vengeance, Bloodseed/scream

Postby Jabroniville » Tue Oct 16, 2012 1:00 pm

Image

ROUGHOUSE
Created By:
Chris Claremont & John Buscema
First Appearance: Wolverine #4 (Feb. 1989)
Role: Classic '90s Vampire Villain
PL 10 (126)
STRENGTH
11 STAMINA 12 AGILITY 1
FIGHTING 8 DEXTERITY 2
INTELLIGENCE 0 AWARENESS 1 PRESENCE 1

Skills:
Deception 2 (+2)
Expertise (Criminal) 4 (+4)
Expertise (Asgard) 4 (+4)
Intimidation 9 (+10)
Perception 1 (+2)

Advantages:
All-Out Attack, Close Attack, Fast Grab, Improved Critical (Unarmed), Great Endurance, Power Attack, Ranged Attack 3

Powers:
"Rock Troll Physiology"
Impervious Toughness 7 [7]
Features 1: Increased Mass [1]
Immortality 17 (30 seconds) (Flaws: Limited to Weapons Forged By Man) [17]

Offense:
Unarmed +9 (+11 Damage, DC 26)
Initiative +1

Defenses:
Dodge +8 (DC 18), Parry +8 (DC 18), Toughness +12, Fortitude +12, Will +4

Complications:
Motivation (Greed)- Despite being Asgard-born, Roughouse is just a simple mercenary, out for cash. He did the bidding of General Coy in Madripoor, but was fired for his repeated failures against Wolverine.
Enemy (Wolverine)
Responsibility (Honor)- Roughouse believes that human life has value, and has a certain sense of honor. Why he works for a dictator and tries to kill Logan is anyone's guess.

Total: Abilities: 72 / Skills: 20--10 / Advantages: 9 / Powers: 25 / Defenses: 10 (126)

-Roughouse is Bloodscream's buddy, and often appeared with him as a duo (maybe their Arching License against Wolverine was a Paired one? Though I guess Sabretooth called "dibs" on that years ago, and they were just renegade members of the Guild). He was a bit more honorable, and was actually shown to be an Asgardian sent down to Earth for some reason in an interesting twist (Claremont seems to dig the Asgard stuff a lot for a guy who never actually got a "Thor" run). Not that bad as far as "Generic Big Lug" villains go. He has the same Immortality to Metal-Forged Weapons that his partner does, making him a bit more dangerous a threat.
Last edited by Jabroniville on Tue Jan 21, 2014 11:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Jab's Builds: Cyber, Ghost Riders- Blaze, Ketch & Vengeance!

Postby badpenny » Tue Oct 16, 2012 4:41 pm

Jabroniville wrote:-That whole "Can't be slain by weapons forged by man" thing is either an Immunity or an Immortality effect (basically regenerating from fatal damage)- I think both can be HURT by stuff like Wolverine's claws, but they can't be permanently brought down by them. An Immunity would cost only slightly more (either a flat 20 points- "Immune to Man-Forged Weapons" or a full Immunity to Damage 80 with a -2 Flaw for the same so it wouldn't cover fire, most super-powers, inborne claws, etc.), so I think the 17 points here is fair.


Does 20 points really cover all the descriptors for "Man-Forged Weapons?" That's Immunity to bludgeoning (clubs, average bullets), piercing/slashing (AP bullets, knives/swords), explosive/fire/heat (grenades, bombs, etc), poison/biological (if you extend it to weaponized BioChem weapons), maybe even Suffocation, possibly Sensory Affliction Effects. That's a bunch for 20 points.

Immunity (Toughness 80; Flaw -2) for 27 points sounds better and restricts it to Toughness effects. You'd then have to buy sundry other effects separately.

Thoughts?


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