DC Comics: Say No to Marriage

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K.G. Carlson
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Re: DC Comics: Say No to Marriage

Postby K.G. Carlson » Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:43 pm

Well, I for one think Batwoman could have used a little micromanagement. I collected the new 52 reboot of Batwoman for 2 years, and Kate asking Maggie to get married was the only forward movement by the character AT ALL. Two years in and she's battling the same villain, solving the same mystery...other than the occasional guest appearance by other heroes, you might have thought they just re-released last month's issue again. How about a little forward movement?

And maybe its just revenge for the Big Bang Theory's razzing, but Aquaman and Mera were the only marriage to survive the reboot! Uh oh, I sense an imminent death beneath the waves...
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Re: DC Comics: Say No to Marriage

Postby saint_matthew » Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:50 pm

K.G. Carlson wrote:but Aquaman and Mera were the only marriage to survive the reboot!


Not according to DC. According to DC they are not married. :D
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Re: DC Comics: Say No to Marriage

Postby American_Patriot » Mon Sep 09, 2013 9:56 pm

Thakowsaizmu wrote:Between this, their flaunting of a new gay writer for a lesbian character, and the Kill Harley Quinn while she's naked contest, I think WB is just trying to kill DC :(


Say wha???

I can't form words... to stunned beyond the capacity for rational thought. what the hell are they thinking? it's almost like the big companies are trying to run themselves out of business.
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Re: DC Comics: Say No to Marriage

Postby Kyle » Tue Sep 10, 2013 6:27 am

I'm kinda torn.

On the one hand, I think DC instituting a no marriage policy and claiming that their heroes shouldn't be happy people is ridiculous. Other than the 'Rot World' storyline dragging on far too long, ANIMAL MAN has been one of the better books of the New 52, and Buddy Baker's family, his interactions with his wife and his children, have been a big part of what makes it great. I'm not married, I'm probably never going to have children, but Buddy's desire to protect the people in his life, and his reaction when he fails to do so adds a distinctly human element to the story.

Eliminating that potential narrative element -- and obviously a character need not have a spouse to have a supporting cast, but I see no reason why that shouldn't be an option -- seems ridiculous. I don't want to cast aspirations or make assumptions, but it's difficult to believe that the editorial meddling in this particular instance wasn't inspired by some bureaucratic fear of blow back if there's a same sex wedding in one of their books. Which means I can only assume that some decision maker wasn't paying attention when the protest against Archie featuring a same sex marriage had the exact opposite result of what was intended.

Also, why shouldn't heroes be happy? Who wants to read about people being miserable all the time? These are men and women who get to wear brightly coloured pajamas in public, can fly, and are able to solve problems by punching telepathic gorillas! Ninety percent of them should never be depicted wearing any expression other than the biggest grin imaginable. The other ten percent live in Gotham, and should cling to whatever slim chance of sanity and happiness they can scrabble out, because that place is just horrible.

As anyone who read DAREDEVIL during the period it was written by Smith, Bendis and Brubaker can attest, the book was really well done, but it became emotionally draining to follow Matt Murdock's miserable life month after month. It got to be where my primary reason for reading the title was grasping onto a thin sliver of hope that maybe something good would happen in the newest issue. That's no fun.

However, I really have enjoyed what I've read from Andreyko. MANHUNTER really didn't get the attention it deserved, and I'm kinda hoping that BATWOMAN will give him the opportunity to bring Kate Spencer into the New 52. Even if that doesn't happen, the book really does need some sort of change, as it's been spinning its wheels for a while now. I don't want to reward DC for making crappy policy decisions, but I do want to read Andreyko's take on BATWOMAN.

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Re: DC Comics: Say No to Marriage

Postby The_Watchman » Tue Sep 10, 2013 6:46 am

American_Patriot wrote:
Thakowsaizmu wrote:Between this, their flaunting of a new gay writer for a lesbian character, and the Kill Harley Quinn while she's naked contest, I think WB is just trying to kill DC :(


Say wha???

I can't form words... to stunned beyond the capacity for rational thought. what the hell are they thinking? it's almost like the big companies are trying to run themselves out of business.


In DC's defense, the intent was something of a cartoony suicide attempt like you'd see in old Looney Tunes cartoons or Mickey Mouse comic strips. The obvious problem is that making it the topic of a contest strips away any artistic intent from DC's side and (if they weren't just courting controversy) becomes just a straightforward bit of blindness to the issues of asking people to draw a woman committing suicide. Yes, the methods she'd use were absurd but that doesn't inherently make them funny or change the basic subject matter. Why not Harley setting up absurd traps for Batman while she gets increasingly frustrated or upset? That would have just as easily established an artist's ability to set up a scene and display emotion without the apparent internalized misogyny.
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Re: DC Comics: Say No to Marriage

Postby Thakowsaizmu » Tue Sep 10, 2013 8:14 am

Kyle wrote:but it's difficult to believe that the editorial meddling in this particular instance wasn't inspired by some bureaucratic fear of blow back if there's a same sex wedding in one of their books.

As bone-headed as DC is being currently, and as much as I think they are trying their best to just run their company into the ground for whatever reason, I honestly do not think this is a "gay marriage" issue. It's not like marriage equality hasn't been shown in comics already, and it's not like they are going to lose readers who might be against "the gays" because honestly, those people aren't reading Batwoman anyway. Any public outcry about "think of the children, won't somebody please think of the children?!" would only serve DC positively, because whereas it wouldn't lose them readers among the mainstream who are already not reading comics, it might actually serve to get some people to at least buy the comic to see what it's all about. So that's free advertising, and that't the best advertising. I honestly do think that DC is just against marriage in general right now. And, from a certain episodic style of story telling, I understand that as a literary device. The problemme is that DC also isn't interested in episodic issues, but instead massive story arcs that, sometimes, take too long. So they are trying to apply one technique to another style altogether and it just serves to make them look foolish and outdated.

The_Watchman wrote:...That would have just as easily established an artist's ability to set up a scene and display emotion without the apparent internalized misogyny.

I actually think your idea about wacky traps for Batman would have been awesome, and would not have had any negative repercussions. DC actually going ahead with the naked suicide contest kind of seems to me like that one guy at the party, where everyone is telling jokes, and he busts out the really inappropriate joke. Not necessarily racist or anything, just the kind of joke that is in the complete opposite direction of the atmosphere and also kind of makes the other party goers really uncomfortable. But, in this case, instead of a few token chuckles and the hostess steering things along, DC decided "no, that! THAT'S what we need! Tell more of those jokes, Uncle Tasteless Joke!" Again, I don't think DC was trying to be actively misogynistic so much as it is a very olde person and it doesn't understand that some things just aren't funny, or cute or a good idea. I think they need someone in their PR or editorial staffing who is under 70, who can say "hey, guys, this isn't a good idea. People aren't going to like this one any more. Also, Hitler's not really a villain appropriate for comics any more either. Oh, and it's called Russia now."
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Re: DC Comics: Say No to Marriage

Postby King Snarf » Tue Sep 10, 2013 8:18 am

Yeah, I don't think the "gay" part is as big an issue as the "marriage" part, as DC has always been a bit further ahead at introducing LGBT characters than Marvel.

It just strikes me as odd. First, DC says they write comics for 45-year olds. Okay, fine. Then, they nix marriages because they're trying to attract a younger audience. Make up your minds!!!
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Re: DC Comics: Say No to Marriage

Postby The_Watchman » Wed Sep 11, 2013 12:46 pm

King Snarf wrote:It just strikes me as odd. First, DC says they write comics for 45-year olds. Okay, fine. Then, they nix marriages because they're trying to attract a younger audience. Make up your minds!!!


If there's one thing young people hate, it's marriage. That's why no successful Young Adult series of the last decade has featured characters getting married*.

*Yeah, yeah, it's usually at the end of the story or an epilogue but if characters are written well, answering the "Will they or won't they?" question with a definite yes does not end the story. It displays nothing but immaturity to pretend it does.
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