Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

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Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

Postby spikevampire » Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:43 am

Hi guys,
trying to work out a rule on how to get the degrees from a heat/fired based attack based on the Damage.
I guess it would work also the other way round.
Do you have any suggestion or house rule?

For example how much damage will suffer someone thrown into the sun?
(I know outer and inner sun have different temperature and the highest are in the core and the end of the flares and it reaches temperatures of 10 million degrees)

-----

as an "help" napalm is suggested to be damage 8 (temperatures between 800 and 1200), lava instead (which generally is same level of heat) is suggested to be 4 damage if in contact only, 15 if half immersed and 18 if totally immersed.

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Re: Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

Postby Monolith » Fri Oct 25, 2013 9:02 am

3e doesn't like to exceed the 20 rank threshold too often, so it's somewhat up to you. Nothing in the game is attempting to reflect reality so trying to find a realistic system is going to be futile.

From a comic perspective the level of the threat really depends on the level of the characters. To a pl 10 character 20 ranks of damage from getting thrown into the sun would probably mean death. To a pl 15 you'd probably need 25+ ranks of damage to achieve the same effect.

As a gm you need to decide on the level of your game and what you want the outcome to be, and then apply numbers based on that. If you want a pl 10 character surviving the sun you need to lower the damage so that he can survive it; and it's the same for a pl 12, 15, or 20. And if you'd expect them to die then you need to raise the damage to make that possible.

The story needs are really going to dictate the damage level. For example, Superman has an 18 toughness. If the sun does 25 damage, dc 40, it's impossible for Superman to make a save. The best he can roll is 38. That means if you decide to make the sun 25 ranks that you're expecting Superman to be injured by going into it. It's a choice your making as a gm.
Last edited by Monolith on Sat Oct 26, 2013 7:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

Postby Mr Mole » Fri Oct 25, 2013 10:38 am

Having taken a hard look at the math involved...

The closest things I've seen in published material is the Gadget Guide: Heavy Weapons, which delves into (among other things) nuclear weapons, which are suggested as damage rank 20 for tactical nukes and up to damage rank 30 for bigger nukes.

Leaving out the damage and incapacitating effects of its enormous gravitational forces, I'd suggest damage from being thrown into the sun would be roughly comparable to being exposed to a continuous nuclear explosion. The photosphere isn't really that much hotter than lava (relatively speaking), so I'd suggest +20 for "full immersion" would be quite workable at that level... Increase the damage rank as you approach the core (temperature unknown, but I'd estimate at least +6 damage above the photosphere).

Factoring in the sun's gravitational pull is another thing entirely... 27.94 times Earth's gravity at the sun's surface...

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Re: Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

Postby spikevampire » Sun Oct 27, 2013 3:18 pm

Thanks for the suggestions guys... I think damage 20 (26) could work and it's kind of within the guidelines of both answers...

Thank you very much!

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Re: Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

Postby JDRook » Mon Oct 28, 2013 4:39 pm

Mr Mole wrote:Factoring in the sun's gravitational pull is another thing entirely... 27.94 times Earth's gravity at the sun's surface...

Hmm . . . well, gravity can be considered a unidirectional Move Object. Calculating what that means leaves a lot of room for interpretation.

If the Str of G is equal to how far something can be moved by gravity in one round (6 seconds) from rest, and assume no drag or other obstacles at Earth surface gravity, you get about a Str of 4. 28x that is under 5 doublings, so that comes out to about Str 9, which seems weak even though it's strong enough to bend steel. This is of course meaningless since gravity is essentially acceleration, and M&M mechanics are in no way geared to account for acceleration, only velocity.
Sorry, I can't hear your argument for realism over the sound of my eye beams. :P

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Re: Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

Postby spikevampire » Tue Oct 29, 2013 5:22 am

well based on your calculation we could say that maximum falling damage on the sun (or maybe it would be more useful to say that about a different planet with the same gravitational acceleration) could be 9 + (2xdistance rank) up to a maximum of 21 this time and a minimum maybe of 4...

Still pretty decent guideline for something complex :)
Thanks!

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Re: Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

Postby Foreshadow » Wed Nov 20, 2013 8:19 pm

The gadgets guide states a nuke is rank 20 and a really big one is rank 30 and the sun essentially blasts nuclear energy off its surface and that surface is nothing compared to the center of its heat level, isn't it like millions of degrees which is at least rank 30.

rank 26 is 1.6 m and 30 is 25 million, surface of sun is 10 million and core is 27 million.

So surface is rank 28 and core is rank 30. It seems anticlimactic but its a doubling system so that is basically a close approximation. Every round ofcourse so that is continuous damage.

So if Superman flies into the sun and regenerates he must have some type of absorption to solar energy.

I know there are hotter things in the universe than our sun so there might just be a rank 40 sun out there.

Then you have the dis-integrative effect of a black hole. Again, a really high rank. I'd go with at least rank 30 for a 'small' black hole, and a massive one of course higher and perhaps much higher depending.

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Re: Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

Postby Monolith » Thu Nov 21, 2013 5:25 am

For games where superman routinely flies into the sun you can simply give him a 1-2 pt immunity (solar fire). In most games, and even in the comics, it's something you see him do once every few years rather then once per comic. It's almost more of a descriptor then an actual effect.

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Re: Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

Postby CAA » Sat Jan 18, 2014 11:39 am

beside heat and gravitation, there is alot of UV and other radiation hitting you. Also it is probably pretty bright up there, so you might want to wear superpowered sunglasses, if you don't want to have your eyes burned out.

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Re: Thrown into the sun damage / Heat level Damage

Postby spikevampire » Thu Jan 30, 2014 12:01 pm

Uhm.. guess 28 surface and 30 core will do. Regarding superman, well he should use his ultimate thoughness to resist I guess uahuahuh


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