free,half and full action attacks and powers

The place to discuss using and abusing the first edition Mutants & Masterminds rules. Rules questions, rules interpretations, house rules, and more rules.
User avatar
Rickynet
Henchman
Henchman
Posts: 207
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 5:11 pm

free,half and full action attacks and powers

Postby Rickynet » Sat Aug 06, 2005 7:59 pm

does a power that require a half action, doing twice (half+half=full), what happend with an attack that is a half action, can a player attacks twice, without the rapid strike feat?, can a player move and attack, move as a half action and attack as a half actions, i always has that question, but i was with half + half, but one of my new players make me think about it, hopely one give an example, in ad&d there is only full actions, then that make me confused, all players including me played ad&d once in our live

User avatar
Evendur
Zealot
Zealot
Posts: 1397
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 1:31 pm
Location: Ontario, Canada
Contact:

Postby Evendur » Sat Aug 06, 2005 9:26 pm

The only way to attack twice in the same round is to use either of the "rapid" feats or heroic surge. Autofire and Multifire will work as well. You could use two half action powers, but not two attack ones. The player can attack and move, move and attack or move-attack-move with the move by attack feat. You can move your base speed as a 1/2 action, twice that as a full round action, and if you want to give up your dex and dodge bounus to Defense you can move four times your base as a full action
H.E.R.O.I.C. Member of the 2nd Rank
Owner of a map to Paradise Island

"See this med-pack? See this gun? These mean the only people dying here today are the ones I kill!" -Field Medic, Cyberpunk Card Game

User avatar
the_masochist
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 547
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:35 am
Contact:

Postby the_masochist » Sat Aug 06, 2005 9:36 pm

out of curiousity, has anyone else allowed characters to put multi/autofire on non-ranged attacks? I use it to represent monk and other martial artist attacks (strike power) but I can't seem to find any real disadvantage to having it on a close combat power.

on top of that, does anyone allow them both to be placed on the same power? you would have a hell of a time trying to hit someone (-10 to each of the 5 attacks) but chances would be 1 out of 4 rounds you would get a crit. hmm... just curious

User avatar
Evendur
Zealot
Zealot
Posts: 1397
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 1:31 pm
Location: Ontario, Canada
Contact:

Postby Evendur » Sat Aug 06, 2005 9:38 pm

I hadn't really thought aobut the non ranged attacks for those powers.

But I wouldn't allow them both on a weapon unless there was a flaw that you couldn't use both in the same round
H.E.R.O.I.C. Member of the 2nd Rank

Owner of a map to Paradise Island



"See this med-pack? See this gun? These mean the only people dying here today are the ones I kill!" -Field Medic, Cyberpunk Card Game

User avatar
farik
Mod Squad
Mod Squad
Posts: 5654
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2003 9:44 pm
Location: I'm lost in some distant part of Nebraska, on a ship -- a LIVING ship

Re: free,half and full action attacks and powers

Postby farik » Sat Aug 06, 2005 10:11 pm

Rickynet wrote:does a power that require a half action, doing twice (half+half=full), what happend with an attack that is a half action, can a player attacks twice, without the rapid strike feat?, can a player move and attack, move as a half action and attack as a half actions, i always has that question, but i was with half + half, but one of my new players make me think about it, hopely one give an example, in ad&d there is only full actions, then that make me confused, all players including me played ad&d once in our live


You are allowed only one attack action per round. Whether that attack is a full, half, or even a free action via some kind of modified power you are limited to just one. Things like rapid or multi are technically one attack since they are against a single target even though they may hit multple times.
One man's hobo booze is another man's fiiiine sippin' wine.

Oh, and by the way, I don't use drawbacks in my game, just complications.

User avatar
the_masochist
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 547
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:35 am
Contact:

Postby the_masochist » Sun Aug 07, 2005 7:54 am

Evendur wrote:I hadn't really thought aobut the non ranged attacks for those powers.

But I wouldn't allow them both on a weapon unless there was a flaw that you couldn't use both in the same round


hmm... I don't see too much of a problem in it being a hand to hand power, but using them together seems balanced on paper (-10 on all attacks for using both) but I dunno... Damn... I'm going to have to play test it now...

(btw, I realized I did my math wrong, its four attacks a round 1 basic, 1 extra for multi, 2 extra for auto, total of 4, not five)

Wait... Farik, does each attack have to target the same person regarding auto and multi fire?

User avatar
Patriarch
Compatriot
Compatriot
Posts: 498
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2005 8:09 pm
Location: Colorado Springs

Postby Patriarch » Sun Aug 07, 2005 7:55 am

What makes you think Rapid attacks forces you to attack the same target? In fact, the feat description for Rapid Strike says, "You can strike multiple opponents with the same attack action."

You might rule that Multifire and Autofire extras must be against the same target, but the wording is a little ambiguous, "Each attack affects the target separately..." Which doesn't indicate to me that the target MUST be the same, only that if it is, each attack is handled as its own.
The early bird gets the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

User avatar
farik
Mod Squad
Mod Squad
Posts: 5654
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2003 9:44 pm
Location: I'm lost in some distant part of Nebraska, on a ship -- a LIVING ship

Postby farik » Sun Aug 07, 2005 7:59 am

You're correct it is possible to hit multiple targets as written (my mistake) but rapid and multi are still considered to be a single attack, I assume it's due to the fact all the "hits" suffer the same penalty.
One man's hobo booze is another man's fiiiine sippin' wine.



Oh, and by the way, I don't use drawbacks in my game, just complications.

User avatar
the_masochist
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 547
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:35 am
Contact:

Postby the_masochist » Sun Aug 07, 2005 8:19 am

could you put multi fire or autofire on a single power twice? in other words, being able to fire off, say, 5 attacks with two autofires and a suffering a -12 to your attack rolls?

User avatar
farik
Mod Squad
Mod Squad
Posts: 5654
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2003 9:44 pm
Location: I'm lost in some distant part of Nebraska, on a ship -- a LIVING ship

Postby farik » Sun Aug 07, 2005 8:24 am

the_masochist wrote:could you put multi fire or autofire on a single power twice? in other words, being able to fire off, say, 5 attacks with two autofires and a suffering a -12 to your attack rolls?


It's ultimately up the GM but yes I've heard of it being allowed.

I've never had a player ask but as GM I'd say the overall concept would dictate if I'd allow a specific character to do it and even them I'd let the player know they might be respending those points if it seems to be disruptive once we start playing.
One man's hobo booze is another man's fiiiine sippin' wine.



Oh, and by the way, I don't use drawbacks in my game, just complications.

User avatar
the_masochist
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 547
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:35 am
Contact:

Postby the_masochist » Sun Aug 07, 2005 10:03 am

in my opinion, contagious and area shouldn't be allowed on the same power. I made that mistake once, by letting a character do that with energy blast, but BAMM in a single turn, nerely took out a city by accident!

User avatar
Rickynet
Henchman
Henchman
Posts: 207
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 5:11 pm

Postby Rickynet » Sun Aug 07, 2005 10:50 am

thanks a lot to all who answered me, i undertood, that if a power does do an attack like energy blast is used like a half action, can one player does twice? without the rapid strike feat? reading that yours writed i think that not

User avatar
farik
Mod Squad
Mod Squad
Posts: 5654
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2003 9:44 pm
Location: I'm lost in some distant part of Nebraska, on a ship -- a LIVING ship

Postby farik » Sun Aug 07, 2005 11:32 am

Rickynet wrote:thanks a lot to all who answered me, i undertood, that if a power does do an attack like energy blast is used like a half action, can one player does twice? without the rapid strike feat? reading that yours writed i think that not


That is correct even though an attack is a half action you can still only do it once.
One man's hobo booze is another man's fiiiine sippin' wine.



Oh, and by the way, I don't use drawbacks in my game, just complications.

User avatar
Rickynet
Henchman
Henchman
Posts: 207
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 5:11 pm

Postby Rickynet » Sun Aug 07, 2005 11:34 am

thanks now i have more clear the picture, i wasnt't that lost

User avatar
Tagnik
Groupie
Groupie
Posts: 60
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2005 8:55 pm
Contact:

Postby Tagnik » Sun Aug 07, 2005 1:45 pm

What about something like "Magic Missle"

Could you do:

Energy Blast (Extra: Energy Blast, Energy Blast, Energy Blast)

To represent the 4 Missles?

What would that be? One roll to hit vs one target, then 4 damage saves, one after the other? If the first one does damage, does that count as a hit for the next one?


Return to “Mutants & Masterminds Rules (1e)”



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests