Plasma Control Question

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Plasma Control Question

Postby Flicker182 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:04 am

Since Plasma Control falls under an array I was curious if you could make it a dynamic array with a few different powers. It lists a few alternate powers and a player of mine is interested in taking it. The power level limit I'm setting the campaign starts at pl 8.

So if she took Plasma Control at 8 under normal circumstances without any feats or extras it would cost 16 pp. However with the power described as an array I have a feeling one could do this. Take a few power feats as alternate powers. Such as dazzle, burrowing, and blast. (I'm not going to write out the pp distribution as I'm curious if said person could make this array a dynamic array.)That would raise it to 19. She could then distribute the points as she'd like in those other 3 powers up to 19 pps correct? Now if it were a dynamic array she'd be able to say (if she distributes it properly) could she be using both a level 1 dazzle effect and a level 2 blast at the same time as long as its set up as a dynamic array?

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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby kenseido » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:07 am

Arrays are standard by default. To make them Dynamic, you have to buy the base power Dynamic and any slots you want to be able to split points between as Dynamic. Plasma Control at rank 8 is 16pp. Three alternate powers would increase the cost to 19pp. Making the entire array Dynamic costs 4 more points (one for the base array, and one for each Alternate Power).

This does not allow you to use the blast and dazzle at the same time. They are not linked.
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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby Flicker182 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:15 am

Okay and in order to link powers how much does this cost? I have never played in the system before and this will be my first time GMing M&M. I would have preferred more experience in the system before GMing but it is what I have to deal with at the moment.

Also, could you look at my post in Gam's Eyes Only? That's my campaign idea and I was wondering if it was a good campaign or if it needs some work.

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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby kenseido » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:19 am

Linked powers is free, but they can't be in different slots in an array. Linked powers only go off together, so if you put them in an array, there is the possibility that one of them won't go off because the slot has no points allocated to it.

Kind of the same reason you can't put Permanent powers in an array. If you can switch the slot, it isn't permanent.
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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby Flicker182 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:25 am

Okay I see what you're saying. Now in the description of Plasma Control it lists alternate powers and effects as different subcategories. Should I count effects as extras under the power point cost or is that something else? The way it was listed I feel I should look at is as extras but I may be wrong.

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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby kenseido » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:27 am

Associated effects are common powers that characters with this power also have. They are no Extras, they are purchased seperately at normal cost for the power.
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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby Flicker182 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:31 am

Thank you so much for the help. I thought it was odd that separate powers were listed in two different sections with one group being able to be taken as alternate powers and not others. I probably would've treated it like an odd array and screwed up her power point total.

Thanks for the help. I appreciate it. I saw other descriptors and was curious why they were labeled differently throughout the books. This makes it that much easier as I'm reading through it.

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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby Greyman » Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:01 pm

Flicker182 wrote:So if she took Plasma Control at 8 under normal circumstances without any feats or extras it would cost 16 pp. However with the power described as an array I have a feeling one could do this. Take a few power feats as alternate powers. Such as dazzle, burrowing, and blast.
Yes. Though you should note that Plasma Control already is Blast with a descriptor built in. It's the base power of the array.
Flicker182 wrote:(I'm not going to write out the pp distribution as I'm curious if said person could make this array a dynamic array.)That would raise it to 19.
21. You must add a Dynamic power feat for each alternate power with which you wish it to work, including the base power.

Plasma Control: Dynamic Array 8 (16pp; Alt.Power 2, Dynamic 3) cost: 21pp {
  • DBP: plasma flame: Damage 8 (Ranged)
  • DAP: plasma flash: Dazzle 8 (visual)
  • DAP: vaporized tunnel: Burrowing 16}
Flicker182 wrote:She could then distribute the points as she'd like in those other 3 powers up to 19 pps correct?
Incorrect. It's just 16; it's the cost of the array minus the dynamic and alternate power power feats. They don't count towards the available power points.
Flicker182 wrote: Now if it were a dynamic array she'd be able to say (if she distributes it properly) could she be using both a level 1 dazzle effect and a level 2 blast at the same time as long as its set up as a dynamic array?
She could configure the array to have them available to use, but both require a Standard Action to activate.

Dynamic does not allow you to activate two alternate powers at once, it allows you to maintain them at the same time. You need to have powers Linked to activate them at the same time.

Dynamic is really designed more to work with a longer duration power, not just a bunch of instantaneous powers. The classic example is a dynamic Force Field arrayed with Flight and Blast dynamic alternate powers; so you can choose to "divert power from the shields!" into propulsion or 'weapons', without needing to drop it entirely.

EG:
Plasma Control: Dynamic Array 8 (16pp; Alt.Power 4, Dynamic 5) cost: 25pp {
  • DBP: plasma blast: Damage 8 (Ranged)
  • DAP: plasma flash: Dazzle 8 (visual)
  • DAP: plasma flare: Linked {Damage 4 (Ranged) & Dazzle 4 (visual)}
  • DAP: vaporized tunnel: Burrowing 16
  • DAP: plasma shield: Force Field 16}

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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby Ysariel » Fri Jun 08, 2012 4:47 am

Can you mix dynamic and static APs in the same array? Adrian Eldritch's example in the rulebook kind of implies you can, but I've never seen a build on the forums that used it.

Could you have, say:

ARRAY Super-Strength 10 (Feat: Dynamic)
-- AP Blast 5
-- DAP Flight

And use the 5 ranks of blast with the remaining 10pp distributed among Flight and Super-Strength?
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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby kenseido » Fri Jun 08, 2012 5:32 am

My understanding is that an AP takes up all the points in the array, where as a DAP is adjustable.

So while you can mix Dynamic with non-Dynamic, if you activate a non-Dynamic power, no other powers can be used.
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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby Greyman » Fri Jun 08, 2012 6:36 am

kenseido wrote:My understanding is that an AP takes up all the points in the array, where as a DAP is adjustable.

So while you can mix Dynamic with non-Dynamic, if you activate a non-Dynamic power, no other powers can be used.
Exactly. An alternate power is all or nothing. If an array is set to one, it cannot share points, even if it does not use all available.

Points can only be distributed between two, or more, dynamic alternate powers.

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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby Flicker182 » Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:41 am

Right, I realized that as I was rereading the plasma control power. I read these rules long ago and am now coming back to them again. It first read like a damaging power with an array but I wanted to make certain I understood it properly.

So she would get 16 pp to work in total with all of the other dynamic arrays that she builds with it. Now it doesn't list any extras under the plasma control heading, but if she wanted to could she potentially take an extra such as selective attack and shapeable. This would raise the cost from 16 pp plus the dynamic alternate powers to 32 plus the alternate dynamic powers totalling 37 as what was listed, correct? If so she would than have 32 pp to distribute amongst her dynamic power arrays and not 16 pp, or is it still 16 pp?

The book states that force field is an associated power. I was just curious to understand if this could potentially work out of allowing her 16 pp or 32 pp to distribute for her array as this could potentially help her in a pl 8 setting.

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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby kenseido » Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:04 pm

Well it would cost 41pp, not 37 (32pp for the array, 1pp for being dynamic, and 8pp for four dynamic al.ternate powers).

But otherwise, you are correct. You would have 32pp to spread among the various powers.

One side note about Extras. You can not put points into an power in your array and leave the extra off.
So you can't just put 16pp into your base power and "not use" the two extras so you get a Blast 8. If you put 16pp into your Base array, your Blast is rank 4, regardless of whether you "use" the area shapeable and selective or not.

As for the Force Field, if you are thinking of putting it in the array, its generally a bad idea to put your attack and defenses in the same array. You will find that you miss your caps (i.e. come up short on attack or defense) a lot.
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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby Greyman » Fri Jun 08, 2012 7:29 pm

kenseido wrote:One side note about Extras. You can not put points into an power in your array and leave the extra off.
So you can't just put 16pp into your base power and "not use" the two extras so you get a Blast 8. If you put 16pp into your Base array, your Blast is rank 4, regardless of whether you "use" the area shapeable and selective or not.
Okay, not quite.

Extras and Flaws are not optional. You can't just choose not to use them. However, you can have alternate powers that do not use them. Such alternate powers don't have to be worth all the points of the array (if, for example, it hits the PL caps). However, they are not limited by the rank of the base power, just the point cost.

Example Array 16: [Blast 8 (Selective Attack, Shapeable-Area), AP: Blast 10, AP: rocket Flight 16].

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Re: Plasma Control Question

Postby kenseido » Fri Jun 08, 2012 7:52 pm

I was trying to say that, but I did it in a round about way. The "quotes" was my "clever" way of saying it.
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