Electric Nunchaku

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selphil
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Electric Nunchaku

Postby selphil » Mon Aug 04, 2008 1:28 pm

I want to make sure I'm doing this right:

My martial arts villain, Electric Dragon, carries a set of nunchaku that deliver an electrical shock when the target is hit. Do I stat it up as the following:

Power Nunchaku: Device 5, hard to lose - [Strike 5, Mighty; Electric Blast 10, Range Touch; Linked, Can Be Used Separately] = 20 pts.

Adds up like this:

Strike 5 (1/rank) + Mighty = 6 pts.
Blast 10 (2/rank) + reduced Range (-1/rank) = 10 pts.
Linked (+0) + used separately (increase the cost of all but the most expensive power by +1/rank - if same cost, choose one) = 5pts. (I chose to increase Strike, thereby doubling its base cost)

Total = 21pts. for the Device's power
Need 5 ranks in device (to get 25pts. of power-buying points).
Hard to Lose Device is 4 pts/rank, so 4 x 5 ranks = 20 pts. for the Nunchaku

Right so far?

Now, my next question:

When Hero X is struck by Electric Dragon's weapon, do I calculate damage as follows:

Str Mod (let's say his mod is +5) + Strike 5 + Electric Blast/Shock 10 + DC 15 = DC 35 Toughness save?

Is this incorrect/too high for a PL10 campaign? Or does the hero save against the Strike and the Electric Shock separately (two saves at DC 25)?

If Electric Dragon is a PL 10 villain, with attack/damage bonus limits at +10, is this breaking the rules? If the damage for the Strike and Blast are calculated together, is the max that this Linked attack could do is +10 -- for a max Toughness DC of 25?

Thanks for your input!

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Postby Dirigible » Mon Aug 04, 2008 1:39 pm

Linking two similar effects is generally a no-no. I can't recall offhand whether the rules specifically prohibit it (I think there might be a rule against linking two Attack effects), but it's certainly one of those things the ThinkTank has, in its collective experience, determined tends to be unbalanced.

In this case, I would give the nunchaku one Strike of whatever rank, with the descriptor being both impact and electrical damage.

Is this incorrect/too high for a PL10 campaign? Or does the hero save against the Strike and the Electric Shock separately (two saves at DC 25)?


If you were to link two Strike / damage effects, it would work as you say here: one save against each effect. You wouldn't add them together.

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Postby Chris F » Mon Aug 04, 2008 1:44 pm

Dirigible wrote:Linking two similar effects is generally a no-no. I can't recall offhand whether the rules specifically prohibit it (I think there might be a rule against linking two Attack effects)

They do. It's in the description of the Linked modifier.

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Postby Driziel » Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:12 pm

Generally the same effect cannot be Linked to itself to “multiply”
the results of a failed save (such as two Linked Damage effects
causing “double damage” on a failed save)


[Disclaimer]this sentence is taken directly from Ultimate Power. Copyright of Green Ronin. if i break some law, i'll personally delete this post[/disclaimer]

As per rules. Strike and Blast are two Damage Effects. AND, the PL of a player limits the maximum DC of EVERY effect of his/her powers. Only Power attack can break the cap

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Postby Shadow » Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:38 pm

First I think Device: Nunchaku would be an easy to lose device [3pp per rank cost].

If you are trying to get an electrified shock power for hand to hand all you need to do is buy the strike power and give it a descriptor. If the ranks of strike are low enough you could add the mighty feat to it and of course you could always add a few ranks of improved critical: power Nunchaku so that when you roll high you do more damage.

Plus if you want it to be harder to save against make it a fortitude or will save instead of tougness. Generally the players I game with have a high tougness and lower saves. The DC will still be 15 + rank but it won't be a toughness save.

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Postby MLChance » Mon Aug 04, 2008 3:30 pm

Related to linking Strike plus touch-range Blast is this clarification under Aura in UP: "If you make an unarmed attack while your Aura is active, a Damage Aura stacks with your melee damage...."

So, it seems quite reasonable for a PL 10 character to have Strike 5 linked to touch-range Blast 5 for a total +10 damage attack. This doesn't break caps, and it requires only a single save.
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Postby selphil » Mon Aug 04, 2008 3:57 pm

Thanks for the answers, guys!

I was just looking at the core rulebook, not UP. I see where the two Linked attacks could be a problem. I thought it seemed awfully damaging.

So in the end, I should do something like this:

Power Nunchaku: Device 2, Easy to Lose - [Strike 5, Mighty; Improved Critical 4; Delivers Electrical Shock upon target] = 10pp, so the actual device costs 6 pts (3/rank for an Easy to Lose Device).

So if Electric Dragon's STR mod is +5, he adds the Strike 5 to come up with his damage 10 + 15 = DC 25 Toughness save if he hits (unless he gets a crit -- then the DC is 30).

Now -- since the attack has a descriptor of "electrical", what happens if he attacks a hero who is invulnerable to electricity? Would this make the hero totally immune to the attack, or would he still take bludgeoning damage? How would you separate these types of damage (the "electrical" vs. the "bludgeoning")?

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Postby Shadow » Mon Aug 04, 2008 4:57 pm

Now -- since the attack has a descriptor of "electrical", what happens if he attacks a hero who is invulnerable to electricity? Would this make the hero totally immune to the attack, or would he still take bludgeoning damage? How would you separate these types of damage (the "electrical" vs. the "bludgeoning")?


It would only make the target immune to the electricity half of the attack, the strength damage would still get through and the target would only have to save vs. damage 5 [unless you crit]. For this type of build you have two damage descriptors. A good example that I have been refered to on a few occasions is to look at hellfire control for an example of dual descriptors.

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Postby Mendicant » Mon Aug 04, 2008 7:01 pm

Plus if you want it to be harder to save against make it a fortitude or will save instead of tougness. Generally the players I game with have a high tougness and lower saves. The DC will still be 15 + rank but it won't be a toughness save.


Is that right? if you take a +0 alternate save extra on a damaging attack, fortitude for instance, the base d/c remains at 15 plus the power's rank, not a new base of 10 for the fortitude save?
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Postby disasterdude13 » Mon Aug 04, 2008 8:34 pm

Mendicant wrote:
Plus if you want it to be harder to save against make it a fortitude or will save instead of tougness. Generally the players I game with have a high tougness and lower saves. The DC will still be 15 + rank but it won't be a toughness save.


Is that right? if you take a +0 alternate save extra on a damaging attack, fortitude for instance, the base d/c remains at 15 plus the power's rank, not a new base of 10 for the fortitude save?


If you use the Alternate Save extra to change the save required against a power its d/c remains 15 plus the power's rank but changing a save from toughness to fortitude or will (can't change it to reflex) is a +1 modifier, not a +0. Alternate Save is only a +0 modifier if used to change from saves other than toughness to something else.
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Postby Mendicant » Tue Aug 05, 2008 10:42 am

disasterdude13 wrote:
Mendicant wrote:
Plus if you want it to be harder to save against make it a fortitude or will save instead of tougness. Generally the players I game with have a high tougness and lower saves. The DC will still be 15 + rank but it won't be a toughness save.


Is that right? if you take a +0 alternate save extra on a damaging attack, fortitude for instance, the base d/c remains at 15 plus the power's rank, not a new base of 10 for the fortitude save?


If you use the Alternate Save extra to change the save required against a power its d/c remains 15 plus the power's rank but changing a save from toughness to fortitude or will (can't change it to reflex) is a +1 modifier, not a +0. Alternate Save is only a +0 modifier if used to change from saves other than toughness to something else.


Thanks, thats good to know.
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Re: Electric Nunchaku

Postby Rabbitman » Wed Jun 06, 2012 9:47 am

The spambots here are getting worse...

Also, what would be the point of Blast limited to Touch range? That's what the Strike power is in the first place.
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