on building the truck

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Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2014 6:44 am

on building the truck

Postby superconfused » Fri Mar 07, 2014 7:41 am

Vehicles table on page 224 of the Deluxe Hero's Handbook:

Size: Huge
Strength 9
Speed 5
Defense 6
Toughness 9
Cost 7

Vehicle Size Categories table on page 22:

Vehicle Size: Huge
Strength 8
Toughness 9
Defense -2

under Size on page 221:

Vehicles start out at medium size by default, and each increase in size category costs 1 power point.

under Strength on page 221:

You can increase a vehicle’s Strength over the base rank for its size for 1 equipment point per Strength rank.

under Defense on page 222:

You can “buy off” the Defense penalty applied to a vehicle for 1 equipment point per –1 penalty removed.

Vehicle Trait Cost table on page 222:

Speed: movement effect cost
Defense: 1 point per +1 Defense

under Vehicle Traits on page 221:

Equipment point costs are summarized on the Vehicle Trait Cost table.

Adding it up I get 2 points for size, +1 point for Strength, +5 points for Speed, +8 points for Defense. That's a total of 16 points, not 7.

I've read the replies to this kind of discrepancy from here, but they've only confused me.

One said that the scratch built cost is actually the DC to invent the vehicle, and suggested that the actual cost is ten less. I have determined that this is incorrect, probably from a misunderstanding of the invention rules.

Another said that there is an automatic +10 bonus on Defense, but did not state on which page of which book this information was from. I have yet to find it in the Vehicles section of my copy of the Deluxe Hero's Handbook. If it does exist, I find it odd that it was omitted from the rules on how to build vehicles. If on the other hand what was referenced to is actually some sort of circumstance modifier as I suspect, then it would rightly be absent.

Even if either of these suggestions were true, my calculation would still be off by 1 point. And the text on trucks does not indicate a Feature that would have made up the difference.

So, I'm still superconfused.

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Re: on building the truck

Postby JDRook » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:40 am

I ran into this a lot while translating characters into Hero Lab. I think something minor may have changed in how they built Vehicles but it never trickled through at some obscure editorial level.

The Defense issue does confuse things. Vehicle Defense is actually really bad compared to PCs: a motorcycle's Defense 10 is equivalent to a PC with Dodge/Parry 0. (That's where that +10 comes from, even though it's not explicitly written.) So your Truck with Defense 6 is equal to Dodge/Parry -4 due to its size. I honestly have no idea why they did it like this, since it just invites confusion. Obviously this make vehicles easy to hit, but genre-wise they are normally more focused on Protection anyway. There are official rules for improving Vehicle Defense using Vehicle Skill and what is essentially a pilot's Defend action listed in the Vehicles Gadget Guide, but generally your truck is going to get hit and either be riddled with bulletholes or have attacks spang off.

Building the Truck with that in mind gives me a total of 8p, which is 1p off the book. If you try the other vehicles, many are 1-2p off. Can't say why that is or how it got through several printings without being addressed, but there it is. Best I can add is that a few equipment points either way is not a big deal and I would encourage a GM not to be too sticky about it, especially when one can make that vehicle fail at any time (out of fuel, engine trouble, combat damage, etc) and not have to give out a Hero Point, just like any other piece of equipment.

Hope that helps.
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