Frequently Asked Rules Questions

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Ophion
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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by Ophion » Wed Apr 13, 2011 1:00 pm

Gotcha. That does help my suspension of disbelief a bit. Thanks!

Next question (and again, this may have been answered somewhere else already and I just haven't found it yet):

The rules for throwing seem to indicate that you can throw something heavier than your "Max" lifting capacity. If you can throw things a distance equal to [Strength Rating] - [Mass Rank], then you can throw your maximum weight thirty feet. You could also throw something twice as heavy as your "maximum" weight fifteen feet, something four times as heavy six feet, and something eight times as heavy as your "maximum" weight 3 feet (you could also move something sixteen times as heavy as your maximum weight one foot, but that's hardly worth noting).

Is this a mistake, something that I'm misreading, or is the book implying that you can throw objects of a certain weight, but not lift them?

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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by Black Mamba » Wed Apr 13, 2011 1:06 pm

Ophion wrote:Gotcha. That does help my suspension of disbelief a bit. Thanks!

Next question (and again, this may have been answered somewhere else already and I just haven't found it yet):

The rules for throwing seem to indicate that you can throw something heavier than your "Max" lifting capacity. If you can throw things a distance equal to [Strength Rating] - [Mass Rank], then you can throw your maximum weight thirty feet. You could also throw something twice as heavy as your "maximum" weight fifteen feet, something four times as heavy six feet, and something eight times as heavy as your "maximum" weight 3 feet (you could also move something sixteen times as heavy as your maximum weight one foot, but that's hardly worth noting).

Is this a mistake, something that I'm misreading, or is the book implying that you can throw objects of a certain weight, but not lift them?
You are focusing on the chart too much. There is no indication that you can throw anything beyond your max weight at all - there is no indication you can pick-up something beyond your normal Strength Rank let alone throw it. If you cannot pick up 200 lbs you certainly cannot throw it 6'. :)
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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by FuzzyBoots » Wed Apr 13, 2011 1:10 pm

Black Mamba wrote:You are focusing on the chart too much. There is no indication that you can throw anything beyond your max weight at all - there is no indication you can pick-up something beyond your normal Strength Rank let alone throw it. If you cannot pick up 200 lbs you certainly cannot throw it 6'. :)
^_^ Although it could be considered reasonable to allow it. After all, the max weight is the amount that you can hold over your head with (unless this got removed in the edition shift) an even greater amount that you can push along the ground. Given that there's already attack penalties for being overburdened, I see no particular problem in a person hefting the weight just long enough to toss it slightly forward or slightly up and over the 3 foot wall in front of you.

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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by Black Mamba » Wed Apr 13, 2011 1:12 pm

FuzzyBoots wrote:
Black Mamba wrote:You are focusing on the chart too much. There is no indication that you can throw anything beyond your max weight at all - there is no indication you can pick-up something beyond your normal Strength Rank let alone throw it. If you cannot pick up 200 lbs you certainly cannot throw it 6'. :)
^_^ Although it could be considered reasonable to allow it. After all, the max weight is the amount that you can hold over your head with (unless this got removed in the edition shift) an even greater amount that you can push along the ground. Given that there's already attack penalties for being overburdened, I see no particular problem in a person hefting the weight just long enough to toss it slightly forward or slightly up and over the 3 foot wall in front of you.
There is no indication in the 3E rules as to what you can do with the weight: dead lift, bench press, military press, etc. I would not be surprised to see more complex Rank rules in the GM's Guide - similar to those in 2E.
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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by Ophion » Wed Apr 13, 2011 1:28 pm

Black Mamba wrote:You are focusing on the chart too much. There is no indication that you can throw anything beyond your max weight at all - there is no indication you can pick-up something beyond your normal Strength Rank let alone throw it. If you cannot pick up 200 lbs you certainly cannot throw it 6'. :)
Right, I wasn't saying there was any indication in the book that you could lift objects heavier than the listed maximum mass for your Strength Rating (I was actually fairly particular about avoiding that statement, as a matter of fact ;) ).

I was asking about throwing things only, as I think the rules for lifting are clear, if a bit vague (such as their not making any distinction between carrying versus dead-lifting and so on).

As to your answer, Black Mamba, that is a very "by the rules" one that you've provided and I certainly won't attempt to argue with it, for my part. However, it is not a particularly logical answer (though that's not your fault).

Here's why: If I can throw 200 lbs. 30 feet, then you had better believe I can throw something heavier than that 15 feet. Thirty feet is actually a pretty decent distance to be able to throw anything weighing more than ten pounds or so (without using learned skills, such as those possessed by T&F athletes). If you can pick up something that weighs, say fifty pounds, and you can actually manage to hurl that sucker a full thirty feet, then it is absolutely guaranteed that you can throw something weighing sixty pounds. How far or high, I don't know, but if you can get fifty pounds to travel ten yards through the air, then you can do something similar with sixty.

Now, I understand that the examples I've just given would not seem to be in-line with the rules as stated in the 3e core book - but the examples I've just given are logical.

So I'll restate my question: Are the throwing rules in 3e purposefully illogical, or is it an accident that is likely to be fixed - through a modification in the rules governing either throwing or lifting - in a future release?

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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by Black Mamba » Wed Apr 13, 2011 1:35 pm

Ophion wrote:Here's why: If I can throw 200 lbs. 30 feet, then you had better believe I can throw something heavier than that 15 feet. Thirty feet is actually a pretty decent distance to be able to throw anything weighing more than ten pounds or so (without using learned skills, such as those possessed by T&F athletes). If you can pick up something that weighs, say fifty pounds, and you can actually manage to hurl that sucker a full thirty feet, then it is absolutely guaranteed that you can throw something weighing sixty pounds. How far or high, I don't know, but if you can get fifty pounds to travel ten yards through the air, then you can do something similar with sixty.
Your statement is predicated on the idea that M&M has that much gradation to it. It does not. M&M does not paint with a 10/0 artists brush. At best it paints with a house painter's roller. Batman has a 4 Strength. That means nothing more then Batman can lift/throw somewhere between 401 and 800 lbs. To you Batman's strength might be 450 lbs, to me 625 lbs, and to someone else 775 lbs. Even throwing something 30' is really just a measure of distance between 16' and 30'.

There is no realism in M&M, nor does it pretend to have any. If you are looking for M&M to represent realistic ideals for gaming you are going to be greatly disappointed. The game simply does not care whether you can realistically throw something 5', 11', or 27'.
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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by Ophion » Wed Apr 13, 2011 1:41 pm

Fair enough. That's both a good and well-qualified answer to my question. Thanks!

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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by xBlackWolfx » Tue May 31, 2011 9:06 pm

here's an utterly noob question, probably not a frequent one, but it most certainly is noob: i am a bit confused over how damage checks work.

i read and understood it in some 2nd edtion sample adventure i downloaded before 3rd edition came out (or at least, i thought i did).

i just read the damage section in the book (listed under powers, interestingly enough). and to me it seems to work quite differently from 2nd edition.

here is what i understand of it:

if you roll a few points below the damage threshold, then you get 'bruised', simply a -1 penalty to your toughness.
if you roll more than 5 points below (like rolling a 15 vs a damage check of 20) then you become 'dazed', and thus can only take one action per round. you also get another 'bruise'
if you roll more than 10 points below the damage check, then you become staggered, which according to the conditions section, means you are dazed again, and hindered. rolling this twice results in defeat
if you roll more than 15 points below the damage check (like rolling a 5 vs a damage check of 20) then you're automatically defeated.

is that right?

and how exactly does regeneration work? all it really describes is removing bruises. what about the staggered condition? will it remove that? the whole description of the regeneration power is confusing to me...

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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by Black Mamba » Wed Jun 01, 2011 7:38 am

Damage in 3E works as follows:

• If you succeed on the roll you take no Effect. If the attack was DC 25 you need to roll a 25 or higher.
• If you miss on the roll by 1-5 you are Bruised and take a -1 to future Damage Resistance Checks.
• If you miss by 6-10 you are Dazed and Bruised: Dazed for 1 Round and take a -1 to future Damage Resistance Checks.
• If you miss by 11-15 you are Staggered and Bruised: Hindered and Dazed until you Recover and take a -1 to future Damage Resistance Checks. a Second Staggered result makes you Incapacitated.
• If you fail by 16 or more you are Incapacitated.

This is basically the same as 2E, though the threshold was changed slight. In 2E it was missing by 1-4 was Bruised, missing by 5-9 was Stunned, missing by 10-14 was Staggered, and missing by 15+ was Incapacitated.

Regeneration recovers 1 Condition per Rank over 10 Rounds. So if you have Rank 3 Regeneration you recover 3 Conditions in 10 Rounds (generally something like 1 on Round 3, another on Round 6, and another on Round 9). You start out only recovering Bruises first. Once all Bruises have been regenerated you then can start recovering more severe conditions. Regeneration works without resting.

So, as an example, if you took 5 Bruises and a Staggered you could recover 3 Bruises in the first 10 Rounds and the the 4th and 5th Bruise and Staggered in the next 10, all while still being active such as chasing someone through a mountain.
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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by tallyrand » Thu Jun 02, 2011 8:49 pm

Black Mamba wrote:Damage in 3E works as follows:
• If you succeed on the roll you take no Effect. If the attack was DC 25 you need to roll a 25 or higher.
• If you miss on the roll by 1-5 you are Bruised and take a -1 to future Damage Resistance Checks.
• If you miss by 6-10 you are Dazed and Bruised: Dazed for 1 Round and take a -1 to future Damage Resistance Checks.
• If you miss by 11-15 you are Staggered and Bruised: Hindered and Dazed until you Recover and take a -1 to future Damage Resistance Checks. a Second Staggered result makes you Incapacitated.
• If you fail by 16 or more you are Incapacitated.
Thanks for laying that out. When you are staggered, what can you do to Recover?
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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by Shadowchaser » Thu Jun 02, 2011 9:08 pm

tallyrand wrote:
Black Mamba wrote:Damage in 3E works as follows:
• If you succeed on the roll you take no Effect. If the attack was DC 25 you need to roll a 25 or higher.
• If you miss on the roll by 1-5 you are Bruised and take a -1 to future Damage Resistance Checks.
• If you miss by 6-10 you are Dazed and Bruised: Dazed for 1 Round and take a -1 to future Damage Resistance Checks.
• If you miss by 11-15 you are Staggered and Bruised: Hindered and Dazed until you Recover and take a -1 to future Damage Resistance Checks. a Second Staggered result makes you Incapacitated.
• If you fail by 16 or more you are Incapacitated.
Thanks for laying that out. When you are staggered, what can you do to Recover?
Aside from using a power like Healing or Regeneration, you can take the Recover Action once per combat to either recover from your greatest Fatigue condition or your greatest Damage condition. This applies to Staggered as well.

Outside of that, you'd need to rest for a minute of game time to recover each damage condition.
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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by Paragon » Fri Jun 03, 2011 10:05 am

Shadowchaser wrote:
Aside from using a power like Healing or Regeneration, you can take the Recover Action once per combat to either recover from your greatest Fatigue condition or your greatest Damage condition. This applies to Staggered as well.

Outside of that, you'd need to rest for a minute of game time to recover each damage condition.
Unless it doesn't work on this, I believe you can use a Hero point for the Recovery function, too.
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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by jspade » Mon Jun 13, 2011 12:07 am

Spending a hero point lets you remove a dazed, fatigued, or stunned condition, or convert an exhausted condition into a fatigued condition, without taking an action. It's not the same as the Recover action, though there's some overlap. Most importantly to my eye, a hero point won't remove a Staggered condition or any accumulated penalties to resist damage.
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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by WyldKnyght » Sat Jul 23, 2011 9:32 am

If you have Continuous Duration effects that are in an Array, can you use them at the same time as another power in that array, since they don't require you to maintain them?

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Re: Frequently Asked Rules Questions

Post by FuzzyBoots » Sat Jul 23, 2011 11:27 am

WyldKnyght wrote:If you have Continuous Duration effects that are in an Array, can you use them at the same time as another power in that array, since they don't require you to maintain them?
No, although Lasting effects can continue forcing saves to end them. Create used to allow for Continuous to remain when switching array slots, but it looks like 3E removed that.

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